Report 294
Report #294 Skillset: Aquamancy Skill: Preserve Org: Aquamancers Status: Completed Feb 2010 Furies' Decision: Preserve time slightly decreased Problem: Here is how preserve works, you freeze the target to remove fire protection, freeze again to cause shivering, freeze again until frozen solid, and preserve when they are solid to make them at half health, then if they are still half health and frozen solid, you may instantly preserve them. This may sound simple in theory, but it has been difficult to pull off. Yes, it is possible to have Aquas to work together, but honestly when you have four or five aquamancers working towards preserve, they are better off doing other things like TK or TP. Typically, you can't get the other guilds to assist in pulling off preserve either because there is no third party message saying the person is frozen if they are being hit by a monk or warrior poisoned blades. Then there is a chance they shrug that poison. But if they are frozen, it is easy to just sip fire and attempt to hinder the mage. Overall, sipping health, reading scroll, sparkleberry, and other passive cures can block this skill very easily. 0 R: 0 Solution #1: Timed kill that works in a deluged room. 0 R: 0 Solution #2: For 2 power, preserve would take the person down two levels from being frost resistant to freezing or they are normal and bring them down to frozen? 0 R: 0 Solution #3: Decrease the time to recover equilibrium so that the caster can keep up with the fire sipping. Player Comments: ---on 2/17 @ 08:13 writes: I don't think it should cost power to chill/freeze the target since it is basically the equivalent of cast freeze. I don't really have any ideas on how to fix this ability though. ---on 2/17 @ 08:17 writes: Oh, and I am saying that assuming solution 1 won't be accepted (since Aeromancers wanted a timed instant kill and was told no). As for solutions 2 and 3, if it turns out being workable for 1v1, I think it will be OP with more than one aqua. ---on 2/18 @ 00:21 writes: I agree Preserve is a bit lacking. Some could argue that it isn't practical under even ideal conditions. However, each of these solutions could be a bit shaky. Solution #1 is a chasm clone. Solution #2 and #3 may well not fix anything. The damage dealt by Preserve is largely moot because even if you hit someone and -almost- kill them (assuming you get them frozen above 50% max health and then preserve), Aquamancers have a horrible damage output making it difficult to follow up. A possible way to make it viable without changing the mechanics of the skill would be to make icefloe give two levels of freeze per tic. This would make it easier to get a target frozen allowing the Aquamancer more time to work towards the other condition: the target being under 50% max health (which honestly for an Aquamancer is no small feat). This skill has two conditional requirements, both of which are rather difficult to do and cannot be done together. One of them needs to be made easier, and tweaking Icefloe would likely have the least out-of-guild repercussions. ---on 2/20 @ 01:13 writes: Preserve was buffed by Desitrus not too long ago when he was Aqua. Its basically setup so three or four aquas can instakill someone if they know what they are doing. Apparently no one knows what they are doing. ---on 2/20 @ 01:14 writes: -immediately- being the key forgotten word. Instantly kill immediately with no setup or problem. Everyone spam the same command at once and win. Preserve needs no change. ---on 2/20 @ 07:29 writes: The thing is, that a lot of abilities can instantly kill people in less than a second. Take telepathy for instance, which is held by four guilds of the basin, that only takes like 3 TPs with at least two with relatively low skill to pull off an insta mindburst? But for preserve, from your logic takes two people near mythical at least to kill someone. While the other two can have freeze, of course. It is just not a logical insta kill that is being told to perform. Most combat leaders desire to pull of much, much easier instas. ---on 2/20 @ 09:59 writes: For reference, Romero was refering to Report #126. In order to pull off an immediate instant kill, you need four Aquamancers and to rely on your target to not sip fire or health. Whether this is good or bad for a mythical ability is debatable. However, if you have one or even two Aquamancers, you will not see this pulled off. I'm not saying it can't be done, but it won't be because there are better options (such as telepathy and telekinesis). The way I see it... removing the immediateness is fine, as long as it becomes viable for a single Aquamancer to pull it off. ---on 2/20 @ 10:03 writes: Of course, we have the option of preservechasm! Timed freezing instant kill. I'm sure no one would complain about such a nerf to immediate preserve, right? Heh. ---on 2/21 @ 03:19 writes: I am okay if I get a skill called Consume that is a timed instakill akin to judge. After all sacrifice is near impossible in groups with even the slightest bit of hindering/gusting out the crucifier. Not like preserve has this requirement. But seriously, I read it on the forums and its possible that freeze levels wouldn't hurt so bad. ---on 2/21 @ 08:20 writes: Though I might find it curious that folk perceive Sacrifice of all things to be 'near impossible' to pull off in a group and attempt to downplay shrivel's low, low cost (which, curiously enough, builds up to that same kill condition), I do echo the sentiment that Preserve, as a whole, is a painfully weak instakill considering the freeze requirement isn't exactly aided by the skillset as much as other melds do. Unless that bit someone mentioned earlier occurred to make it so that IceFloe afflicted with 2 levels of freeze instead of its current 1 and that dragonturtle's breath attack were made to afflict with a level of cold too (no idea why it doesn't since the phoenix and thunderbirds do), all the other suggestions would just make the ability a veritable clone of others in existence. ---on 2/21 @ 15:22 writes: Wasn't icefloe changed a while back to do 2 levels of freeze if you have fire up (so it will drop you from protected by fire to shivering in one go)? I seem to recall that being envoyed ages ago. Maybe it didn't actually go in? ---on 2/21 @ 17:07 writes: Nope, icefloe only gives one level of freeze. The old change (Report #126) was that preserve strips fire and gives shivering if they have fire up. ---on 2/21 @ 17:11 writes: What Viynain suggested is good and balanced for one or two Aquamancers. With more than that, though, it might be a little overwhelming if timed correctly. Perhaps make the power cost a bit higher, like 0/5 or 0/6. 0 for freezing levels, 5 or 6 after frozen. ---on 2/22 @ 19:09 writes: Balancing around group mechanics is always an iffy thing, and the suggestion I wrote wouldn't vary much at all from any group instakills currently possible, I'd think. ---on 2/23 @ 16:21 writes: One thought might be to re-order needlerain and icefloe, so that if they are timed to tick together, needlerain will always hit before icefloe. That means once all the other elemental defenses are stripped, needlerain will strip fire every round. Throw in some beast spit mactans (or turtle freeze if they get that) and you might have something. ---on 2/24 @ 20:00 writes: The turtle afflicting directly with freeze rather than mactans would be better, I think. Shrugging possibilities and all versus just a direct affliction.